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 Post subject: regarding shield feint talent
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:35 am 

Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:51 pm
Posts: 87
i've seen rulings in the past where flavor text and/or the title of a spell/talent...etc can change the effects of what the said ability is meant do. while reading the flavor text of shield feint, it is stated "that the knight, while utilizing the shield to parry a blow, feints and releases the shield tossing into his opponent's field of vision..." while the effects portion states he "drops" his shield, to which i assume it is meant he pretends "drops" his shield. my question then is, does the knight actually "toss" the shield thus leaving him w/o a shield unless he takes the time to retrieve it, or does he just pretend to drop it? i guess this comes down to the argument of the spirit vs. letter of the law(rule), but in my opinion it makes a big difference mechanically speaking as to which i would be seeing that the knight would loss a shield bonus if he tosses it

oh by the was shield feint can be found in the order of the phoenix pdf


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 Post subject: Re: regarding shield feint talent
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:37 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:06 am
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Location: Portland OR
I think you loose the shield. Which isn't that hot mechanically...but on the other hand the dog the path grants is hot. Fluff says you toss your shield. Crunch says you drop your shield (not your guard). I assume after the manuever you lack the shield.

My 2 cents

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 Post subject: Re: regarding shield feint talent
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:47 am 

Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:51 pm
Posts: 87
now i don't have the pdf in front of me right now, but if i rememebr it correctly in the effects description the word drops is in quotes which makes me think that it implies something different then actually dropping it to the ground. especially since the talent is shield feint,not drop your guard or equipment. your just trying to use your shield to distract the bad guy.

when it comes down to it, to me its just whats is the meaning of the quotes


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 Post subject: Re: regarding shield feint talent
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:39 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:36 am
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Yeaaaaahhh. uh I don't know, looking at the PDF I think the fluff is important here, and I tend to side with Eric that you actually drop your shield (probably in an adjacent square)

but I can totally see the argument for the other side of the coin. and the intent is kinda nebulous so your mileage may vary.

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 Post subject: Re: regarding shield feint talent
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:22 am 
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Location: Central Alberta
My read of the talent is that the shield isn't actually dropped, but thrown at the enemy (or appears to be thrown at the enemy) to serve much the same function as throwing a handful of sand in their face to distract them. From the read of it, the shield (when the manouver is done) is still in their hand as the word drop is in quotation marks, indicating that the word was meant to be illustrative rather than descriptive.

Of course, I can see MANY problems with the physics of this, not the least of which being that most shields are quite heavily braced on the arm and is not easily 'tossed'.

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 Post subject: Re: regarding shield feint talent
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:41 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:08 am
Posts: 1362
Hello gentlemen,

The blame for this idea is mine, not Pete. Pete took the idea that I had and translated it into mechanics.

In my ill-spent youth, I did some Ren Faires as part of the Human Chess Game. One of the maneuvers I did was to turn my shield so that it was on top of my arm, then tossed it towards my opponent, letting the first strap slip off my hand, making him dodge it while I then swung at him.

I don't have the PDF in front of me at the moment, so I don't remember exactly how Pete wrote that up, but that was the intent.

I'll try and review the offending text this evening and let you guys know.

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 Post subject: Re: regarding shield feint talent
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 12:09 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:47 am
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Location: Central Alberta
Did you intend for the throwing of the shield to do damage, or simply act as a distraction while you hit them with your other weapon?

If so, may I suggest the following text:

Quote:
Effect: Weapon, You release your shield as part of this attack
maneuver granting you a +3 bonus to hit. You attack as if
you are using your bastard sword as a two-handed weapon.
Your released shield is then dropped in an adjacent 5' square
to the one you are occupying.

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Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Divine Holy Judge of Nier
Ruma val'Vasik, Martial Crusader and Master of the Spear
Jorma Osterman, Arcane Coryani Battlemage


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