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 Post subject: Arc 2 Soft Point Module numbers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2016 10:58 am 

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:17 am
Posts: 208
I noticed something about the Soft Point module numbers.
Trouble's Tide use to be SP 12, but it was pulled to be worked on
When Unbated and Envenomed came out it was given SP 12
But now Unbated and Envenomed is SP 13, and Trouble's Tide was re-released as SP 16
So now there is no SP 12.
Was this intended or should it be fixed?

And what ever happened to SP 6? It is a module that needs to be worked on before being released?

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 Post subject: Re: Arc 2 Soft Point Module numbers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2016 11:09 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:12 pm
Posts: 1037
If I remember right, A2SP6 is Edge of the Knife. At U-Con, everyone who had played it said it would be best not to ever play it as it was horrible. It's possible they decided not to release it due to feedback like this. However, if so, it is frustrating as it is yet more xp that it is impossible to ever catch up on.

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 Post subject: Re: Arc 2 Soft Point Module numbers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:47 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1353
wilcoxon wrote:
If I remember right, A2SP6 is Edge of the Knife. At U-Con, everyone who had played it said it would be best not to ever play it as it was horrible. It's possible they decided not to release it due to feedback like this. However, if so, it is frustrating as it is yet more xp that it is impossible to ever catch up on.


As I understand it, it requires a significant rewrite in order to make it worth playing. Having played it, it had significant issues.

As for XP and "catching up" I doubt there are many characters if any that have attended every special and on top of that got maximum XP for all of it. Regardless, XP should be a byproduct of having fun as the character grows over time. Unlike the old 3.5 campaign, the rewards aren't Tiered based on the level you play them at. With very few exceptions, all of the gear provided as rewards including runes and magic items are all usable by Tier 1.1 characters.

If you're playing with other characters in the same Tier you won't likely notice a lot of power difference either. If you're a caster at 2.1 with your Tier 2 spells available sitting with a 2.5 caster with the same Tier 2 spells, they may be able to autocast more than you can, but there's still rough parity in terms of capabilities.

Enjoy the journey with the character. My primary's gone through a lot of changes over time from the way I originally envisioned him. The growth's been fun though, so I wouldn't change it.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


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 Post subject: Re: Arc 2 Soft Point Module numbers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:48 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1353
The one difference between 2.6 Edge of the Knife and 2.12 is that the same mod got moved, leaving that original # empty. It's possible that 2.6 might eventually get fixed and released, but not sure what will happen with 2.12.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


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 Post subject: Re: Arc 2 Soft Point Module numbers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:29 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:12 pm
Posts: 1037
Hat wrote:
As for XP and "catching up" I doubt there are many characters if any that have attended every special and on top of that got maximum XP for all of it. Regardless, XP should be a byproduct of having fun as the character grows over time. Unlike the old 3.5 campaign, the rewards aren't Tiered based on the level you play them at. With very few exceptions, all of the gear provided as rewards including runes and magic items are all usable by Tier 1.1 characters.

If you're playing with other characters in the same Tier you won't likely notice a lot of power difference either. If you're a caster at 2.1 with your Tier 2 spells available sitting with a 2.5 caster with the same Tier 2 spells, they may be able to autocast more than you can, but there's still rough parity in terms of capabilities.

Enjoy the journey with the character. My primary's gone through a lot of changes over time from the way I originally envisioned him. The growth's been fun though, so I wouldn't change it.


I agree very few people have played everything. However, every time a module is not released that was promised (2-3 BIs/specials, A2SP6, and possibly a couple others), it adds to the disparity in character rank. I'm sure a lot of people would disagree with me but I think that, if a module was supposed to be released and isn't, then they should release the cert (at least for the xp) so that people are not "robbed" of xp they should have gotten.

I disagree a little bit with your tier examples. I find that a gap of a half tier or more makes a huge difference. This can be reduced by a good GM (using multiple tier stats or the like) but it is still a problem. It's particularly frustrating to be either the lowest or highest at a table if there is a big gap.

I do enjoy the journey and Ss'kethis has changed a fair bit from the way I originally envisioned him (though he will likely be getting rebuilt once the Ssethregore book is released).

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 Post subject: Re: Arc 2 Soft Point Module numbers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2016 2:53 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1353
wilcoxon wrote:
I agree very few people have played everything. However, every time a module is not released that was promised (2-3 BIs/specials, A2SP6, and possibly a couple others), it adds to the disparity in character rank. I'm sure a lot of people would disagree with me but I think that, if a module was supposed to be released and isn't, then they should release the cert (at least for the xp) so that people are not "robbed" of xp they should have gotten.


Before I ask my questions, let me state that my intended tone is curious not challenging.

So the questions I have with the last part - how often are people impacted by the disparity in character rank? If someone currently caps out at 2.7 and another character has gotten the specials and is 2.9, is that significant? How often are they sitting at the same table? Is there a mod impact other than to authors who need to generate a potentially higher tiered stat block to characters not playing at the most difficult level?

All rewards are untiered. I can appreciate that our characters may not have earned as many ranks as someone else, but we haven't invested the time. Other than wanting to have the opportunity to have earned the extra ranks to play around with additional abilities, what have we lost? "Robbed" seems like a pretty strong statement. Am I missing something?

wilcoxon wrote:
I disagree a little bit with your tier examples. I find that a gap of a half tier or more makes a huge difference. This can be reduced by a good GM (using multiple tier stats or the like) but it is still a problem. It's particularly frustrating to be either the lowest or highest at a table if there is a big gap.<snip>


Things become more noticeable at the half-Tier gap and moreso if there's a full Tier. If the half-Tier gap doesn't bridge Tiers it's less noticeable. It also depends on the individual builds of the characters. I'm sure Vincens could be more effective than how I've built him, that just hasn't been the journey he's gone through. We're going to see discrepancies though even without the specials given that 1.5 certs start almost 4,000 XP behind a character that's gotten max XP for all the mods that it replaces.

Things are going to be imperfect when you include a lot of people and variables. We all do the best we can.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


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