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 Post subject: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 6:46 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1278
Greetings. Here's a spell I came up with. I'm not sure which of the 3 effect options would make the most sense, so am looking for feedback.

Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
Tradition: Heritage (Val) [Tier I], Heritage (val'Borda) [Tier I]
Category: Advanced
CTN: 20 (18 + 17 - 15)
Speed (Strain): 3 (+5) [2 +1/2(1) = 3, 4 + 1/2(1) = 5]
Range: Self
Duration: Scene

Effect: With the completion of this spell you bring forth a fine quality stiletto of solid shadowy light, brightest at the tip of the blade and fading into a dark handle. It is a light, Speed 4 weapon dealing d6 (Primary) damage. Against Undead, Spirits and Infernals, this weapon bypasses all AR. When used against Entropic creatures this weapon deals d8 (Primary) damage and bypasses all AR.

Special: If thrown or released the blade darkens into a standard shadow dagger, losing the brilliance that provides additional benefit against Undead, Spirits, Infernals and Entropic creatures.

Adaptation: Increase the CTN by 5 to add your passive Resolve Modifier to all damage rolls.

Adaptation: Increase the CTN by 3 to summon a second Dark Blade of Illir to wield in your off-hand.

Adaptation: Increase the CTN by 3 and Strain by 1 to apply a Die Bump to the damage die. This Adaptation may be applied multiple times.

Adaptation: Increase the Strain by 1 to increase the number of Dark Blades manifested. Any not in hand darkens into a standard shadow dagger, losing the brilliance that provides additional benefit against Undead, Spirits, Infernals and Entropic creatures.

Adaptation: Increase the CTN 3 to apply one of the following Fine Runes: Frost, Shadow, or Celerity. This Adaptation may be applied multiple times, adding a different Rune each time.


Effect [Version 2 - Completely Intangible]
Effect: With the completion of this spell you bring forth a fine quality stiletto of shadowy light, brightest at the tip of the blade and fading into a dark handle. At first this blade seems completely harmless as it simply passes through living beings as well as solid objects. Its true power is evident when used against the impure. Against Undead, Spirits, and Infernals this weapon acts as a light, Speed 4 weapon dealing d6 (Primary) damage bypassing all AR. When used against Entropic creatures this weapon deals d8 (Primary) damage.

Special: Though it is shaped as a dagger, it doesn't have any real weight or balance, making it impossible use any weapon tricks with the dagger.

This blade may not be thrown and if released the weapon simply vanishes. When attacking you can use any melee skill.

NOTE: All Adaptations are the same.

Effect [Version 3 - Old Version 1 - Partially tangible Tangible]
Effect: With the completion of this spell you bring forth a fine quality stiletto of shadowy light, brightest at the tip of the blade and fading into a solid dark handle. At first this blade seems completely harmless as it simply passes through living beings as well as solid objects. Its true power is evident when used against the impure. Against Undead, Spirits, and Infernals this weapon acts as a light, Speed 4 weapon dealing d6 (Primary) damage bypassing all AR. When used against Entropic creatures this weapon deals d8 (Primary) damage.

Special: Though it is shaped as a dagger, only its handle has any real weight or balance, making it possible to only use the pommel strike weapon trick. This does normal damage, not bypassing AR.

This blade may not be thrown, or released (the blade simply disappears upon doing so) and when attacking you can use any melee skill. The handle fades 12 ticks after being released.

NOTE: All Adaptations are the same.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


Last edited by Hat on Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:55 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 8:55 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:47 am
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Location: Central Alberta
And how can you mix a val'Assante and a val'Borda power?

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 9:11 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:36 am
Posts: 1544
Gladius of light (general) and Manipulation of shadow (val'Borda) are combinable

I like this spell!, tho i think that Effect 2 is the only one that can actually be used

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 9:21 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1278
Nierite wrote:
And how can you mix a val'Assante and a val'Borda power?


Because Gladius of Light is a common Tier 1 Heritage spell, not val'Assante specific. With the one spell producing a blade of pure light and Cadic being referred to as the Dark Hand of Illir I gave it a more colorful name.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 9:34 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1278
SamhainIA wrote:
Gladius of light (general) and Manipulation of shadow (val'Borda) are combinable

I like this spell!, tho i think that Effect 2 is the only one that can actually be used


I still struggle with that. The blade on the gladius of light is completely intangible which is why it will pass harmlessly through people. The handle can't be intangible or it couldn't be grasped. A shadow dagger is fully tangible, yet shares the disapation effect if released for too long. That's why to me it felt like the mixed version would combine a more solid hilt / pommel with the intangible blade. That was also why the only weapon trick that could be kept was the pommel strike as it's the only part of the weapon that was solid.

You still couldn't throw it as the minimum time to disappear when released dropped from 12 ticks to instantaneous, at least for the blade. The gladius of light spell specifically noted that regardless of form, the weapon always kept the same speed/damage properties which is why I left that alone. Also, the trade off of +1 speed for a die bump is normal, so with the dagger becoming speed 4, d6 is within norm. Striking with the solid hilt though lost the benefit of bypassing AR as it wasn't intangible any more.

To me at least, it felt like the proper blending of the spell. Because this isn't clear cut though, I wanted to submit it here for review and get other people's take on it. Hopefully my explanation will help folks in their assessment.

All feedback definitely welcome.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 9:42 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:47 am
Posts: 2381
Location: Central Alberta
Hat wrote:
Nierite wrote:
And how can you mix a val'Assante and a val'Borda power?


Because Gladius of Light is a common Tier 1 Heritage spell, not val'Assante specific. With the one spell producing a blade of pure light and Cadic being referred to as the Dark Hand of Illir I gave it a more colorful name.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


Forgive me, 7am is a terrible time to think and notice things ;)

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Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Divine Holy Judge of Nier
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Jorma Osterman, Arcane Coryani Battlemage


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 9:54 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1278
Nierite wrote:
Forgive me, 7am is a terrible time to think and notice things ;)


No worries. Sorry if my tone sounded a bit harsh. It was not intended.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 11:47 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:12 pm
Posts: 1032
I think I lean towards a modified version 3 - it acts as a normal fine dagger (speed 3 or 4 though?) except against creatures affected by Gladius of Light in which case the extra damage and bypassing AR comes in.

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 6:41 pm 
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I think the spell would have its uses, but would just apply the Stacking rules to make it work.

Vs eligible Targets: as per Gladius of Light
vs non-eligible Targets: as per Manipulation of Shadow.

The big advantage is having both running at once (and only having to adapt them only once).

I'm in the middle of a BI online currently and had Gladius of Light up to fight some big infernals; I had to use Pugilist against the cultists as I couldn't afford to drop the spell, draw a real gladius and then recast after killing the cultists to go back after the infernals.

:goes to look at CoH options: Nope, its too talent intensive to pick up access to Cadic spells (and that would be Divine anyway, which can't be Advanced).

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight's Knife)
PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:32 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:46 pm
Posts: 1278
wilcoxon wrote:
I think I lean towards a modified version 3 - it acts as a normal fine dagger (speed 3 or 4 though?) except against creatures affected by Gladius of Light in which case the extra damage and bypassing AR comes in.


What you're describing is pretty much option 3, which SouthernSkies also agreed with. I am leaving the speed as 4 as the Gladius of Light spell specifically states that the stats on the weapon remain constant even if the weapon is in a different form which it is occasionally. Interesting that there's no defined adaptation to do so. To drop the weapon to Speed 3 would require an exceptional quality weapon and nothing in the write up of either spell would indicate that.

Thanks for the feedback.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul


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