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 Post subject: Re: About the val'Holryn Family
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 12:49 am 
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:creepy voice from a brown-robed old man:

"You will never find a more vile den of sin and iniquity outside of Nishanpur."

:/creepy voice:

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 Post subject: Re: About the val'Holryn Family
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2019 6:16 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:06 am
Posts: 1958
Location: Portland OR
vandom43 wrote:
Tralia
Population: ~90,000-100,000
Ruler: Duke Konrad val'Holryn
...snip...
This isn't the original city of Tralia: Old Tralia was initially on the opposite side of the Tares River, before it was destroyed by Leonydas val'Virdan after the death of Prince Volthar val'Holryn (time for another archaeology expedition). To the north is Canceri and the Blighted Mire, ...snip....
Glad you mentioned Old Tralia. You are so right that an adventure set there would be cool. Though on the other hand it seems likely to have been picked over by now. Personally I have always thought of Tralia as being "a cousin" to the Borderland countries featured in the Wheel of Time books (Like Shienar). Tralia at its heart is a fortress and THE hub of defending the border from both invasion from Canceri & various horrors that spill out of there, or Faerdlau Woods, or the Blighted Mire. I imagine that the farmlands are fertile and picturesque. But I also expect the Cantons find "something" that keeps them "busy" as many seasons as not. If you have to travel at night on the roads of the Duchy of Tralia, I bet most people go in a group and armed. (Commoner or noble, if you live in Tralia I think you are probably armed).

vandom43 wrote:
The city itself is a center of intellectual and religious significance, as in past years the Arch-prelate of Tralia was the highest authority of the Church in the north.
It would be interesting to know if this is still true. Or how true. The Arch-Prelate of Tralia has traditionally been an Illiirite. Sabinius was the Arch-prelate and most senior member of the Milandesian clergy...and then became Primarch in their new church. However following his "passing," *coughcough*ahem*cough* the current Primarch is Ferric val'Ossan. Presumably Ferric is a Yaricite priest. Is he from Tralia? I would suspect Naeranth instead. It's possible that Tralia's historical primacy in religion is potentially in question. A possible friction point in Milandir at present.

vandom43 wrote:
In addition, The Great Library of Tralia itself holds a great number of books within, an excellent place to read up on the many epics and stories of the north.
The best Library in Milandir. Possibly with the exception of a presumed Royal College in Naeranth.

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Eric Gorman

AKA Ambassador Tukufu, man of letters, tomb raider and Master Sword Sage
. . . and Sir Szymon val'Holryn, Order of the Phoenix
Formerly Sir Jaeger val'Holryn. Weilder of the Holy Avenger: Thonanos. Gave his soul to help free King Noen


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 Post subject: Re: About the val'Holryn Family
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2019 3:37 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:47 am
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Location: Central Alberta
Oh Tralia. . .

My understanding of Tralia's significance (this is from a fan, not anyone of authority) is that Tralia is the ancient "big city" which has become eclipsed by the upstart Naeraanth. It's old, it's populated, but its streets are tight, the infrastructure is a bit shoddier, and it just isn't as "imperial" as the new capital. If I recall correctly, Tralia was always something of a major power in the region, while Naeraanth only came to prominence because it was not destroyed during Leonydas val'Virdan's Theocracy of the Cleansing Flame (Tralia was very possibly a leader in the anti-Nierite resistance as it was led by a val'Holryn).

The way I think about it would be like Russia in the 1800's or so between Moscow (the old capital) and St. Petersburg (the new one). Moscow was the original capital, the seat of the Metropolitan (and later Patriarch) of the Russian Orthodox church, and was the home of a lot of the traditional aristocracy which followed the traditional Russian cultural practices. St. Petersburg began its life 1) as part of Sweden, and 2) as a bog in the middle of nowhere and Tsar Peter built a new glittering capital based on European models with urbane architecture, art, refined tastes, etc. Fast forward 100 years to about 1800 and St. Petersburg was considered a mecca of European culture with the latest fashions, concert halls, embassies, etc, while Moscow was this dark almost provincial city but of so much cultural significance the Tsar couldn't fully ignore it despite how 'embarrasing' it was to some of the Tsars for its backwards views and traditions. Of course, this changed following the Napoleonic wars when that same effete European (read: French) culture became tainted in the eyes of Russians and they began focusing more on Russian-ness again, but still.

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 Post subject: Re: About the val'Holryn Family
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 6:47 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:06 am
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Location: Portland OR
Ahhh... something new from Cody to chew and ruminate on. Nice.

Nierite wrote:
Oh Tralia. . . My understanding of Tralia's significance (this is from a fan, not anyone of authority) is that Tralia is the ancient "big city" which has become eclipsed by the upstart Naeraanth. ...snip... Naeraanth only came to prominence because it was not destroyed during Leonydas val'Virdan's Theocracy of the Cleansing Flame (Tralia was very possibly a leader in the anti-Nierite resistance as it was led by a val'Holryn).
(I also speak as a fan and not someone with special privileged information.) In the time of the Cleansing Flame it is certainly possible that old Tralia was a more important site than Naeranth. Still we're talking about events roughly 2700 years ago in the campaign world. That's a little bit like explaining the modern middle east through the prism of events in 700 BCE. Which (thank you Wikipedia!) included: king Sennacherib launching (another) campaign into the Chaldean region, against the Babylonian rebel Merodach-Baladan II who conspired against him. Also Babylon's Assyrian-raised puppet king Bel-ibni died after a 3-year reign. He was replaced by Sennacherib's son, Ashur-nadin-shumi...

While I don't disagree that Tralia took a big hit getting burned to the ground by Leonydas, I think a better explanation is that Naeranth is a huge port on the ocean with easy access to Censure, Savonna and New Althre. Also it may well be the nearest major port for trade that comes out of the Blessed Lands. Against that Tralia (the city) is the jumping off point for all trade with the Black Talons and the Canceri trade that goes North-South. As well as a site that controls at least some precious materials. Not nothing! But also not on par with what's on offer in Naeranth. In short: when looking for an explanation of relative "power" between the two cities I prefer to put my chips down on geography...

Nierite wrote:
The way I think about it would be like Russia in the 1800's or so between Moscow (the old capital) and St. Petersburg (the new one). Moscow was the original capital, the seat of the Metropolitan (and later Patriarch) of the Russian Orthodox church, and was the home of a lot of the traditional aristocracy which followed the traditional Russian cultural practices. St. Petersburg began its life 1) as part of Sweden, and 2) as a bog in the middle of nowhere and Tsar Peter built a new glittering capital based on European models with urbane architecture, art, refined tastes, etc. Fast forward 100 years to about 1800 and St. Petersburg was considered a mecca of European culture with the latest fashions, concert halls, embassies, etc, while Moscow was this dark almost provincial city but of so much cultural significance the Tsar couldn't fully ignore it...snip
Hunh. I can certainly imagine that. But I've always thought about it in different ways. As a leader in the Milandesian League and as a province of the Coryani Empire I think Naeranth has always been preeminent. So I don't think in any political sense Tralia has been replaced. I think it's always been Milandir's "second" city (sorry Tresslau!). For real world comparisons I've always reached toward places like Budapest or maybe Pitesti in modern day Romania (It was sometimes the capitol of Wallachia when that was a thing). Budapest was never Vienna... Basically it's a major bastion of "order," or "civilization" and a regional power in a strategically vital area. It sits close to a contested borderland with "the other." Canceri. It's serves as either the rallying & launching point or the center of resistance depending which way the tide of armies are flowing this decade. Pitesti isn't somewhere anyone has probably heard of, but it's currently one of the regional capitols of Romania and may make an especially good comparison because it was also located on a river which it guarded against the Ottomans (mostly by the Bassarab dynasty which ultimately included "that guy" called Vlad). Pitesti was also a major center of learning way back in it's heyday.

Just my two cents. Moscow has an advantage over Pitesti in that we call know where it is. I agree Tralia is a crowded walled city with narrow streets.

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Eric Gorman

AKA Ambassador Tukufu, man of letters, tomb raider and Master Sword Sage
. . . and Sir Szymon val'Holryn, Order of the Phoenix
Formerly Sir Jaeger val'Holryn. Weilder of the Holy Avenger: Thonanos. Gave his soul to help free King Noen


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 Post subject: Re: About the val'Holryn Family
PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:40 pm 

Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:48 pm
Posts: 53
Well, I've basically dumped everything I know into this post, so if anyone would like to contribute, that would be great. There still is a whole lot that I don't know, as the val'Holryn are an all-around weird family. As such, I will continue to update this post as more information becomes available/Henry decides that I can spam Legend Lore in my downtime.

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Sigismund Jupiter val'Holryn von Tralia, Veteran of the Citadel of Silence


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