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 Post subject: SP2-12 Trouble's Tide
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 9:00 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:59 am
Posts: 813
Location: Ontario, Canada
We ran this module last night, and while overall I quite liked it, a few issues did arise.

Despite this thread being in the spoilers section I do want to note that I will be going fairly thoroughly through some plot information, so readers beware.

One of the big things that I really did like was the inclusion of passive skill values to determine certain pieces of information. Especially for Empathy checks, I really do like being able to simply provide information to PCs instead of constantly asking them to roll. I find that asking a PC to roll Empathy makes them immediately suspicious.

Scene Two

Page 5 - Writing Desk: Tells GM to provide Player Handout 5, Player Handout 6 (List of Potential Targets) and Player Handout 7 (Notes about Alejandro). It appears that the information on handouts 6 and 7 was all compressed onto Player's Handout 5 and the references to Handout 6 and 7 were removed. This caused a fair bit of confusion, should be corrected to just say provide players with Handout 5.

Scene Three

Player's Handout 3 (the only piece of evidence pointing groups to this Scene who don't have a Sanctorum member) references Reno Lugar's library, but the scene has absolutely zero information on it. My group was interested in taking a look at his library in the hopes that it would give them some clues as to what Nicolai was investigating, but I had no information to provide them.

Additionally, Reno is described as being a runesmith, but there is nothing at the start of the module advising that there is a runesmith available to PCs.

Scene Five

The information from Player's Handout 5 states that everyone who disappeared had been in contact with Alejandro Olivia, and also indicates that Nicolai was having difficulty locating the man. I recognize that this information was essentially a red herring, but considering that this guy comes across as a reclusive drunk it doesn't make sense that he would have had contact with so many missing people. The PCs also commented that it was very easy for them to find Alejandro, so why couldn't Nicolai? There isn't necessarily anything wrong here, but personally I would add a couple steps to locating Alejandro.

Regarding the cursed amulet, it isn't clear how exactly Father Gregori would take the curse onto himself. Is that done simply by wearing the amulet? What happens if a PC wears it? I assume that the previous bearer has to be dead for the curse to be transferred (or a remove curse or unravel the threads), but some clarification wouldn't hurt.

Scene Eight

This is the only major issue I have with the module. The first seven scenes are fairly solid investigative scenes, and then this scene makes them all irrelevant. Basically it doesn't matter what you've deducted up to this point, because you get randomly attacked by thugs and then figure out where the lair is from them.

The biggest change I would like to see in this module is for the PCs to be able to gather enough information in Scenes 1-7 to track the cultists to their cave, and have the fight occur in/near the cave where the prisoners are held. This way the investigation actually matters.

Scene Nine

The 'other prisoners' in the cave aren't named. Are these people whose names are on the list? How many are there? How are they being held in the cave? I told the players they were in a cage, but it isn't specifically stated.

Scene Eleven

Between the two tiers of this fight the Dweller is either T2 or T3, but in both cases it is a TN 28 horror check when the PCs first encounter him. 28 seems very high for a group of mostly T1.5 characters (which is what I had), is it intentionally the same for both tiers?

Additionally, if the PCs have already encountered a Dweller in the Deep (What Lies Beneath), is the horror check necessary, or do you give them a lower TN, seeing as they are already somewhat familiar with the creatures?

Conclusion

The secrety society orders for the Sanctorum instruct them to search for/rescue Teo Rana. What happened to him? There is no information in the module about him aside from a brief reference in Scene Three. Then, in the wrap up, the GM is advised that Sanctorum members get a successful conclusion if they rescue Nicolai.

The first paragraph under the heading "Story Achievements and Special Items" states If both Father Nicholai and Father Pablo are turned in to the Inquisition, this should probably be 'Father Gregori and Father Pablo'

This same section states that Each Hero receives A Bottle of Vinum Soldatis (Relic Page), but the only way I can see in the module for PCs to obtain one is by purchasing it for 1 Gc from Lazaro. Does Nicolai gift them to the PCs? Considering the benefits of the Vinum, I would think it more appropriate to make a limited number purchasable, as opposed to giving them out for free.

Additionally, if possible it would be great if there were maps for this module.

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Akira Currier
aka Raseri 'Crash' val'Emman - Master of the Incandescent Flame (Martial 3.7)
aka Leif - Skohir Warped One (Martial 2.6)
aka Rurik - Nol Dappan War Priest (Divine 2.3)
aka Karthik - Tultipetan Stonemason (Expert 1.4)


Last edited by acurrier on Sun May 03, 2015 6:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: SP2-12 Trouble's Tide
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 12:12 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:41 am
Posts: 486
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
acurrier wrote:
Scene Eleven

Between the two tiers of this fight the Dweller is either T2 or T3, but in both cases it is a TN 28 horror check when the PCs first encounter him. 28 seems very high for a group of mostly T1.5 characters (which is what I had), is it intentionally the same for both tiers?

Additionally, if the PCs have already encountered a Dweller in the Deep (What Lies Beneath), is the horror check necessary, or do you give them a lower TN, seeing as they are already somewhat familiar with the creatures?


For the first part of this, I will say that is probably a mistake on my part during the editing process. Generally speaking, with Horror effects from creatures (either by a special attack or a horrific appearance), the Horror TN is equal to the passive skill value of the creature. In this case, iirc, it should be 22 at the lower Tier and 26 at the higher, but I will need to double check. Please keep in mind that this is a guideline, not a commandment written in stone.

As to the second part...yes, the check is necessary. Sometimes, things are just as (or more?) terrifying as when first encountered. I think a good movie/story reference to reflect this is Halloween. Laurie Strode (Jamie Lee Curtis) is obviously terrified by Michael Myers at several points in the original movie. She fights through it and survives. Then, 20 years later (Halloween H20), she comes face to face with him through the door with the window...she knows she can survive this guy, but the look on her face is...yup! Failed Horror check.

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 Post subject: Re: SP2-12 Trouble's Tide
PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2015 6:50 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:36 am
Posts: 1554
Yah I wrote the module along with Lindsay and I had to download the mod to see what you were talking about on a couple of things.

Like the vinum soldatis , that want supposed to be a magic item. guess who _just_ found out that was a magic item.. this guy.

and most of the things you are talking about are things that happened in editing (where the handouts were created) encounter 7 happens in response to a certain person being questioned, if you dont question him then it dosent happen and the mod goes off track. and thats fine its just not what i see the normal course of the adventure being.

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Oswald val'Inares V, The Seeker of the Val'Inares
Harvester Lord of the Eastern Fields of Iowa


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 Post subject: Re: SP2-12 Trouble's Tide
PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2015 9:46 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:36 am
Posts: 1554
After looking at this more indepth, there are a lot of words in that module and the certs that Lindsay and I havent written or even seen. We are talking with the campaign staff and hopefully there should be an update to the module forthcoming. If not I will make available something to clarify the orginal intent we had as writers.

--Josh & Lindsay

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Oswald val'Inares V, The Seeker of the Val'Inares
Harvester Lord of the Eastern Fields of Iowa


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 Post subject: Re: SP2-12 Trouble's Tide
PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2015 10:25 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:59 am
Posts: 813
Location: Ontario, Canada
Just re-ran the module this evening, noticed more issues with the stat blocks. For instance, the priest in the high tier has a +12 to his trained skills, but only +7 to hit with his weapon (which he appears to be proficient with). A full review of the stat blocks probably wouldn't hurt.

Josh & Lindsay, I understand fully. I've noticed when working with other systems how bizzare changes can pop up during editing. Overall it is a good module, just a few changes required in my opinion.

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Akira Currier
aka Raseri 'Crash' val'Emman - Master of the Incandescent Flame (Martial 3.7)
aka Leif - Skohir Warped One (Martial 2.6)
aka Rurik - Nol Dappan War Priest (Divine 2.3)
aka Karthik - Tultipetan Stonemason (Expert 1.4)


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