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 Post subject: Overbearing...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 11:14 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:25 am
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Location: Dallas, TX
Playing around with the idea of an overbearing attack, essentially a "group grapple". Rather than have a bunch of assist rolls, I wanted to lump things together nice and easy with a single modifier. The idea here came from a band of minions looking to attack a single target. Minions were easy. A group of PC witch hunters attempting to do the same required a bit more thought. So here's what I came up with:

Overbearing Grapple [Complex Action]
Multiple combatants can pile on to grapple a single target as a group. The overbearing group makes a single opposed Unarmed (Wrestling) roll against the target as normal, but receives a +2d bonus for each additional combatant in the group. The target rolls an Athletics or Unarmed (Wrestling) roll in response. If the overbearing group achieves more success than the target, it is considered grappled. If the group rolls a number of successes equal to or greater than the target’s Avoidance, the target is considered Pinned as well.

Minions: A minion band attempting to overbear a single target rolls an opposed Attack roll with a +2d bonus. This tactic is opposed normally. Minion bands may not be overborne, though a single minion can.

Larger/Smaller creatures: Targets larger or smaller than the overbearing group receive a +2d bonus to their opposing Athletics or Unarmed (Wrestling) roll for each size category, larger or smaller, they are than their opponents. For example, a Large creature would receive a +4d bonus to avoid being overborne by a group of men. Likewise, a tiny creature would also receive a +4d bonus.

Initial Thoughts:
+2d per combatant might be a bit generous. Using Assist Ally to compare, this assumes a base of 2 successes rolled by each combatant with a -2d penalty. It might be smarter to dial this down to +1d per combatant, especially since each grappler effectively cancels a size category of critter.

OTOH, what if instead of using Avoidance to Pin the target we used Fortitude as the base required. This would make larger creatures MUCH harder to pin with an overbearing attack.

Hmmmm....

Tom

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 Post subject: Re: Overbearing...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 5:21 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:48 pm
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Keep in mind that Witch Hunter is as much swashbuckling as it is horror. Having tons of people grabbing onto a single target can sometimes be horrific, but it's not good for swashbuckling-style action. Frankly, I prefer to ignore the grappling rules altogether except in rare circumstances (e.g., someone is grappling a traditional vampire to expose his chest for a stake, or the vampire grapples someone else as a pre-requisite for a bite). Having said that...

The rules that you've provided make mechanical sense for minions and multiple lieutenants, but it's rare to have PCs with identical Unarmed (Wrestling) pools. Do you use the highest or the lowest?

How many people within the group have to work to maintain the grapple?

How does the timing work on it - does everyone have to delay to the same time?

If the overbearing group is going up against a strong opponent (i.e. an opponent with a good Athletics or Unarmed (Wrestling) pool), then they are likely to fail to grapple the target or pin the target, with little in the way for middle ground. Maybe require the Difficulty for Pinned to be the target's Avoidance + successes on the opposed roll?


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 Post subject: Re: Overbearing...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:00 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:25 am
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Location: Dallas, TX
Herid,

Oh, very much aware of the whole swashbuckling aspect. I don't use a lot of grappling-it's usually that PCs that instigate there. No, the scene that inspired this idea had to do with a mob of unseelie fae attempting to capture one of the PCs and take him back beyond the veil to be questioned by their master. So I may just need to edit it down to a Minion maneuver. However, I can also see other applications for it as sort of an "assisted grapple", so I wanted to account for that. What if the PCs use a net to capture a large creature? See where I'm going?

So yes, I figure you'd use the highest grapple pool of the group and add bonuses to account for the rest. But it makes for a very effective minion maneuver. Say the inquisition is trying capture a witch Hunter alive for questioning.

The timing poses an interesting dilemma, but yes, everyone could hold to go on the same turn I suppose–that's easy enough. Really, overbearing works whenever more than one combatant attempts to grapple a single target. It doesn't have to be the whole party.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll mull this over and update things accordingly.
Tom

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Witch Hunter: The Invisible World Unofficial Home on Google+


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