The Sorcerer King Vs Leonidas

and in this corner we have the Living flame of Nier, right after getting out of the first lockup, but before this retirement in obscurity in the blessed lands. Man this guy has been locked up for a few years and his temprament is incendiary!

For some reason he has a burr under his saddle to go and visit the pillar of Nier that is located on the ymandrake isle and that leads us to the other contender.

The Sorcerer King, the self proclaimed god of magic (Sarish when asked for an interview on this subject did not respond) had laid claim to the arcane magic users of arcanis, and arcane magic him self... but still has been laid low by a simple curse that prevents him from setting foot on the mainland(reports have not reached us if he is still vacationing on the southern continent, all of the corespondents seem to have been devoured)
He is fairly pissed this upstart from the mainlaind has come a knocking and didnt bother to bring any tribute

So here is the ultimate match up of the mortal made "gods" on arcanis, on magic on martial...Who wins?

Hmmmm. . . Assuming Leonydis is in his prime (pillar of fire himself), I would have easily given it to him as little as a few decades ago in-story. The Sorcerer-King is pretty powerful, but we're talking about a man who overthrew the most powerful Empire of Humankind in history, while the Sorcerer-King seemed to struggle a bit with laying the Myrantian Hegemony low. That said, the first time The Sword of the Heavens disappeared, it was ultimately the work of a single EXTREMELY Mysterious child, while the Sorcerer-King was laid low by the combined might of the Myrantian sorcerer-priesthood.

Now, though. . . I might have to give it to Mr. SK (can't remember his 'given name' that was leaked to us on the old board. Something starting with an O or U?). We have no idea just how powerful he got after he absorbed the Valinor's special magic organ, so not only is he THE mage of the world, but he also now has access to the Divine essense of a demigod. That means the SK has got 2 sources of power, while Mr. val'Virdan only has one.

Still'd be epic, however!

I think I have to disagree here. Any confrontation between Leonydis and the Sorcerer King also has to factor in their armies. Now, in his prime, Leonydis was considered to be an Avatar of Nier (whether or not he was, in fact), and his army was pretty well unbeatable. The Nierites were to the best of our knowledge mostly melee-oriented, but these guys cut their teeth by clearing out dens of Voiceless Ones in Canceri. For fun! Despite the fact that the SK has an army of casters, we know that the Nierites have experience fighting casters (between the VO and Coryani battle mages, etc), and they must have developed some defences against magic.

Now, it is reasonable to assume that Leonydis would have brought the fight to the SK at Ymandragore. I believe it is in the original Codex Arcanis that it talks about Ymandragore being covered in statues to the SK that are involved in his acquisition of power. Something to the effect of people exchanging arcane power for minor blessings.

As I see it, the Nierite armies would lay siege to Ymandragore. They may suffer heavy losses due to all the spellcasters, but they would destroy everything in sight as they go. I suspect that the SK would actually lose a lot of his power as his followers (worshippers?) were destroyed. Considering how the SK treats the slave races on the Isle, I wouldn't be shocked to see a number of them joining the Nierites.

When it came down to the final fight, I suspect that Leonydis and the SK would be pretty evenly matched. At the end of the day though, where Leonydis would have been pitted up against many casters over his life, we aren't aware of the SK ever having to face a serious physical threat. If for some reason the SK wasn't able to win with magic, I doubt he would know what to do, other than flee.

Point to remember: Apparently, the two of them may have already squared off. Looking back at my notes, the name of the Sorcerer-King was something along the lines of Amath, which just happens to be the name of 'a mysterious sorcerer. . . who claimed to hold the secret to Leonydas' destruction.' (Canceri Sourcebook, pg 9)

If we can get a confirmation that Amath was the SK's name, the last time these two powers came to power, the SK 'won.'

Hello Cody, et al.



I can say this:

The Sorcerer King was referred to as Amanth by Losknek and there was a mysterious sorcerer that proved crucial to delivering the spell that entombed Leonydes in a pillar of frozen flames.

Now, was it the same person/entity?

Or is Amanth just a popular name like Ashley or Richard?

Hmmm.....

OH SNAP, well back to the drawing board on EPIC Arcanis battles.... maybe i wont be foiled by connected threads of plot

Not necessarily.

Amanth (if the Sorcerer-King) was only one of those responsible for freezing Leonydas. You also had the sickly boy who freaked the hell out of the Sarishans out for his ability to flaunt the Sarishan Oath. Amanth was the second, who provided the knowledge to cast a powerful spell to bind Leonydas. If it wasn't for the sick boy, Amanth may not have been able to do squat. Additionally, the ritual to bind him required an entire army under Ulisay val'Tensen to keep Leonydas busy while it was cast.

Overall, if it came down to a pissing match between them and only then, Leonydas would have won. Now, though, Mr. Sorcerer King has had almost 3000 years to learn new tricks. Leonydas, on the other hand, has been knocked down a couple times now, so maybe he's past his Avatar-ish prime?

One of these days, Henry, you are going to have to answe for all your mysterious comments

Yeah, like that will ever happen.

Amath may be the SKs name. But another possibility is that it was the name of the fallen (?) Cunning of Sarish. The valinor the SK "ate" in his continuing bid for true divinity. So was Amath who bound Leo the SK? A valinor? Some other dude? We aren't sure. At least I'm not. Though I believe it was the SK who engineered Leo's downfall. Presumably to eliminate a rival power or threat...after all we can guess that the Sword of the Heavens was not going to be in favor of some Sorcereror trying to seize divinity, and worshipers away from the PoM.

So given all this I tend to think Leo could win this fight in some form of cage match scenario.

On the other hand it's not clear to me how you'd ever get a cage match. Palic val Holryn, defender of the Empire took the Legion of Phoenix and vanished without a trace when he sailed for Ymandragore. I have a hard time imaging how an Erdukeen army would fair any better. One does not lay siege to the Isle of Tears or launch a frontal assault on its main harbor. My best guess for what happens to Leo and his Neirite army in such a scenario is that their fleet goes down to the bottom before they reach shore, and they any neirites who somehow make it shore are "converted" to the true faith by compulsion or blown up by sorcery. If Leo somehow makes it to shore its without an army at his back...and under those conditions surely the SK defeats him with all the might of the Isle of tears at his back.

So overall I lean SK.

One question that has always bugged me is how did the last of Nier's pillars of flame get to the Isle of Tears? Has it always been there? Or has the SK somehow moved it? Either way makes for interesting questions. If the former how did Leo get through it to complete the tests of the Warrior of the Eternal Flame? And did he meet the SK? And if so what did they say? What deals were struck? .... If the later then how did the SK move the pillar and why isn't 't this noted anywhere? Shouldn't the Temple of Nier have a major grudge against the SK for tampering with it?