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 Post subject: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:12 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:12 pm
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If you take Prestidigitation and Arcane Spell Casting at the same time, you get the advanced/sustained universal spells. If you take Prestidigitation first, you don't. What if you take Arcane Spell Casting first? Do you get the advanced/sustained spells or not?

I found this when revising my leveling plan for my primary character (Undisciplined Psion background qualifies for Sword Sage which gives ASC at T2 without needing Prestidigitation first - ideally, I'd just skip Prestidigitation but I need it to rank up in ASC).

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:17 pm 
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You cannot gain Arcane Spell Casting without getting Prestidigitation either first or at the same time, and the only time you can gain them at the same time is at character creation.

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:41 pm 
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wilcoxon wrote:
If you take Prestidigitation and Arcane Spell Casting at the same time, you get the advanced/sustained universal spells. If you take Prestidigitation first, you don't. What if you take Arcane Spell Casting first? Do you get the advanced/sustained spells or not?

I found this when revising my leveling plan for my primary character (Undisciplined Psion background qualifies for Sword Sage which gives ASC at T2 without needing Prestidigitation first - ideally, I'd just skip Prestidigitation but I need it to rank up in ASC).


Undisciplined Psion through Spontaneously Awakened only allows you to take Arcane Spell Casting (which you need to get into Sword Sage). It doesn't give you the talent for free. You still need to take Arcane Spell Casting, which requires you have Prestidigitation.

John

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:01 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:12 pm
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Nope. Sword Sage requirements:
Quote:
Val, Arcane Spell Casting: Psionic (ta) *OR* Spontaneously Awakened (ta), and Melee (Any) as a trained skill

Undisciplined Psion gives Spontaneously Awakened which qualifies (emphasis on "or" added by me).

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:09 pm 
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wilcoxon wrote:
Nope. Sword Sage requirements:
Quote:
Val, Arcane Spell Casting: Psionic (ta) *OR* Spontaneously Awakened (ta), and Melee (Any) as a trained skill

Undisciplined Psion gives Spontaneously Awakened which qualifies (emphasis on "or" added by me).


If you get Arcane Spell Casting only through the Path II of the Sword Sage, you'd get NONE of the Universal Spells then as those are given specifically by Prestidigitation (and Prestidigitation in combination with the Spell Casting Talent).

John

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 9:41 pm 
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Location: Portland OR
wilcoxon wrote:
Nope. Sword Sage requirements:
Quote:
Val, Arcane Spell Casting: Psionic (ta) *OR* Spontaneously Awakened (ta), and Melee (Any) as a trained skill

Undisciplined Psion gives Spontaneously Awakened which qualifies (emphasis on "or" added by me).


Interesting. Yes in this this case you get none of the universal spells. You could get the base universal spells by going back and then taking prestidigitation.

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 10:35 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:12 pm
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val Holryn wrote:
wilcoxon wrote:
Nope. Sword Sage requirements:
Quote:
Val, Arcane Spell Casting: Psionic (ta) *OR* Spontaneously Awakened (ta), and Melee (Any) as a trained skill

Undisciplined Psion gives Spontaneously Awakened which qualifies (emphasis on "or" added by me).


Interesting. Yes in this this case you get none of the universal spells. You could get the base universal spells by going back and then taking prestidigitation.


Okay. That's what I was unclear on. If you take Prestidigitation before ASC, it's clear you only get the base universal - I'd just never seen it addressed if you take ASC before Prestidigitation (and later take Prestidigitation). It seemed to me, in this case, you have the formal training so I was guessing you'd get all Universal spells (same as if you took them at the same time) but I'm fine with it either way.

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:32 am 
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Location: Portland OR
Yeah, I don't think you get ALL of the universal spells. I think you just get the base spells because you haven't taken the two talents at the same time. Which kinda sucks for this case ... but doesn't seem like an inappropriate thing for an undisciplined psion. You should have to work hard to get to where your more formerly trained friends are (you get other benefits). Though I don't know, I'm not sure the rules people ever thought about or planned for this scenario.

Tukufu is now a Master Sword Sage. Its definitely a tasty path.

And this is just my opinion. I'm not official. And ultimately I'm wrong in my opinions as often as I'm right on the boards

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:02 am 
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So if you're an Expert, as long as you take ASC and Prestidigitation at the same time, you're going to get all of the spells that an Arcane or Divine caster would get?

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 Post subject: Re: Prestidigitation after Arcane Spell Casting?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:10 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:36 am
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@todd thats correct, and there is a little bit of leeway in character creation, that if you take both of those talents during character creation you get the advanced spells, (they dont have to be taken at the same step)

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